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Paint Guy 10-17-2010 03:41 AM

Startup Disc and Hard Drive Partitioning Questions
 
Hi, I just bought two 2 TB Firewire Mac Hard Drives. I want to use the drives for:

? File Storage
? Software Backup
? Startup Disc

I want to copy the same information to both drives and will store one onsite and one offsite. I have a few questions I don't understand though so if someone could explain a few things I'd appreciate it. Thanks.

1. Backing up Applications
Is there a way to store/save my applications on the drive so if my computer crashed I wouldn't have to reinstall the software and serial no's etc? What's involved to do this? Please explain.

2. Can I use the Hard Drive as a Computer?
Is it possible to use a part of my 2TB Hard Drive as a computer if my computer crashed and is this called a "Startup Disc"?
For example let's say my computer bit the dust, is it possible to connect to my 2TB external drive and still use the applications and then drag them onto a new computer? How would I set this up?

3. Partition Sizes?
Can I partition the drive into different parts and if so how do I determine how much space to partition for applications, startup and storage?


pg
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dnanian 10-17-2010 03:01 PM

1. While you can often install the software *application* on an external drive, most applications have other content that gets installed in the system folder. As such, you can't really do what you're trying to do, no.

2. I don't really understand the question. You can certainly use a full "Backup - all files" as your startup drive, if that's what you mean, if the internal goes down. This is explained in a lot of detail in the User' sGuide.

3. I have no way of answering this. You sort of have to look at your situation and decide how big your partitions should be...

TMay 10-17-2010 09:36 PM

fb

Maybe I can help a little. First, if you are going to do complete SuperDuper backups of your computer's hard drive, then you don't need to separate the three "functions" or whatever you would call them in your list. The backup disk will have all that information on it: it will have your applications, ready to use, all of the rest of your information, and a functioning operating system (the same one that is on the computer you are backing up.)

This also means there is no need to partition your new drives. (Which as you probably know is done with the Mac's built-in application Disk Utility, when you do need to partition.)

Either one of these backup drives, when plugged into any other Mac and set/selected as the startup drive will boot and run that machine just like you were running the one you copied from (assuming of course that they are Macs that will run the system version in question, etc.)

You test all this by (after you are through with the copying) trying first one drive, and then the other, as a startup disk for your present machine to make sure they work.

Hope this helped. (Notice everything in this answer assumes you are going to be using "Backup--all files" as your copy script in the main SuperDuper window.)

Paint Guy 10-20-2010 05:56 PM

Thanks Dave and TMay.

I have read the Super Duper manual but I am confused as to the best way to do this. Here's what I'm thinking might work. Please tell me if this is correct?

I have 4 Drives.

A 100GB LaCie Drive (business and graphic storage)
A 300 GB Mac Hard Drive (Macintosh Hard Drive)
A 2 TB External Firewire Drive (Currently Empty)
A 2 TB External Firewire Drive (Currently Empty)

What I wanted to do was to keep one of the 1TB drives at home and store the other 1TB drives off the premises. Maybe I will have to "Clone" my Mac Hard Drive to a separate External Drive and then use 2 separate drives for storing my artwork. Here's why. If I Clone my Mac Hard Drive to my 2TB external drive then how do I also "Add" my artwork to the 2TB external drive without erasing the existing contents? Is this even possible if I want the 2TB external to be "Bootable".

I want to "weekly" Clone my Mac Hard Drive to the 2 TB External drives and then store one of them off site. The problem is my mac Hard Drive is only 300 GB and I have more files than will fit on my mac hard drive so how do I do this?

Here's what I thought might work. Please see if my steps are correct.

1. First I will copy all of my Artwork and Business Files from the External LaCie to the 2 TB Drive.
Super Duper Application:
Copy: "LaCie HD" to "2 TB Drive"
using: "Backup All Files"
During copy: Smart Update
Now all of my graphics should be copied from my 100 GB LaCie Drive to the 2 TB Drive.

2. Now I want to Clone my Mac HD to the 2 TB Drive.
Super Duper Application:
Copy: "Mac HD" to "2 TB Drive"
using: "Backup All Files"
During copy: Smart Update (Smart Update will not erase files already on the external 2 TB Drive)

Now my Mac Hard Drive should be cloned to the 2 TB Drive.

3. Now my external 2 TB drive will have all of the (files and artwork) of my LaCie and a Clone of the Mac Hard Drive and the 2TB external drive will be bootable so if my mac crashes then I can boot from the 2 TB Drive. Is this correct?

4. Now I can just clone the 2TB Drive to the other 2TB drive and then store it offsite.
Super Duper Application:
Copy: "2 TB Drive" to "2 TB Drive"
using: "Backup All Files"
During copy: Smart Update (Smart Update will not erase files already on the external 2 TB Drive)

5. Then weekly I will have to manually Clone the 2TB Drive to the other 2TB drive as I will be adding new artwork and files to the 2TB drive that is onsite.

My only fear is if I select the wrong setting then I will totally write over either my artwork or my applications. Is there a better way to do this or is this the best way? Should I be cloning my Hard Drive to a separate drive than my artwork? This would prevent me from overwriting something I don't want to over write. Please explain in detail. Thanks.

Also how do I know if my new Mac 2TB Firewire Drive is GUID or not. It probably is because it's a new drive. If I plug it in and Super Duper recognizes it (it's not greyed out) then am I good to go?
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dnanian 10-20-2010 08:11 PM

You partition the 2TB drive into two (or more) volumes, at least one per source volume. LaCie HD goes to LaCie HD Backup. Mac HD goes to Mac HD Backup...

Paint Guy 10-20-2010 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dnanian (Post 29889)
You partition the 2TB drive into two (or more) volumes, at least one per source volume. LaCie HD goes to LaCie HD Backup. Mac HD goes to Mac HD Backup...

Thanks Dave, ok, that make sense so when I use Super Duper I can choose which drive I want and apply the settings that best apply to that drive. I think I'll call one: "Artwork Backup" and the Other "Mac HD Backup". That should work shouldn't it?

I am thinking of partitioning the drive this way. My Mac Hard Drive is currently 300 GB which is OS and Applications.

Mac HD Backup: 500GB
Artwork Backup: 1.5 TB
___________________
= Total 2TB

Just out of curiosity, what if I don't divide it right at the beginning. I'll bet I'll have to reformat/erase the whole drive to change the partition size. Correct?
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dnanian 10-20-2010 08:37 PM

Just remember that your 1.5TB, if you're going to use SD! to copy to it, can only be used for that purpose. If you want to store other items on the drive, you'll want another partition.

iPartition (and Disk Utility in some limited situations) can change partition sizes nondestructively.

Paint Guy 10-20-2010 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dnanian (Post 29891)
Just remember that your 1.5TB, if you're going to use SD! to copy to it, can only be used for that purpose. If you want to store other items on the drive, you'll want another partition.

iPartition (and Disk Utility in some limited situations) can change partition sizes nondestructively.

Thanks, What do you mean by? "If you want to store other items on the drive you'll want another partition". Please explain.

The "Mac HD Backup" partition would include the OS and all applications. (And would be "Bootable")
The "Artwork Backup" partition would include video, 3D, graphics, word files etc. (Not Bootable)

Not sure what another partition would be used for. Do you think I've given too much for the "Artwork Backup" partition? Please explain!

Are these the correct instructions to format my 2TB external drives.
http://www.shirt-pocket.com/forums/s...ead.php?t=5738

pg
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dnanian 10-20-2010 09:38 PM

Smart Update, as it says, is like erase-then-copy. So you put other items on a volume that you smart update, those items will be removed when you smart update.

If your source drive is a 100GB drive, then 1.5TB is, indeed, too big. But if it might grow to 1.5TB of data, then it's not. Much of this is stuff you kind of have to decide for yourself...

Paint Guy 10-21-2010 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dnanian (Post 29893)
Smart Update, as it says, is like erase-then-copy. So you put other items on a volume that you smart update, those items will be removed when you smart update.

If your source drive is a 100GB drive, then 1.5TB is, indeed, too big. But if it might grow to 1.5TB of data, then it's not. Much of this is stuff you kind of have to decide for yourself...

Question 1
If the 2TB Drive has 2 partitions. one named "Mac HD Backup" and the other named "Artwork Backup" then don't I just choose the one I wan to back up to and use "Smart Update"? For example if I select the "Mac HD Backup" partition and select "Backup All Files" and "Smart Update" then it will clone the Mac Hard Drive and Copy over the files needed but won't touch the files in the "Artwork Backup" Partition. Copying files to one partition won't affect the other partition. Is this correct?

Question 2
I have spent a lot of time going through the steps (see below) I think I need to take after I partition the drive into 2 drives. Please tell me if my steps are correct as I need to do this tomorrow. Thanks. :)

To backup to: "Mac HD Backup"(This is the 500 GB partition in the 2 TB Drive)
You want to crate a "Clone" or exact copy of the Mac Hard Drive which can be "Bootable" in case of Hard Drive Failure.
1. Super Duper - "Backup Script"
First Time Backup Use: "Backup All Files" (Clones/Copies the Mac HD and will create a "Bootable" backup in case of Hard Drive Failure you can boot from this.)
Second or Third Backup Use: "Backup All Files"

2. Leave "Repair Permissions" unchecked.

3. Super Duper - "During Copy Setting"
First time Backup Use: "Erase Backup, then copy files from Macintosh HD" to backup the Mac HD (this will create a "Bootable" backup)
Second or Third Backup Use: "Smart Update Backup from Macintosh Hard Drive" to backup the Mac HD (this will create a "Bootable" backup but will only copy or delete files and folders as necessary taking less time.)

To backup to: "Artwork Backup"(This is the 1.5 TB partition in the 2 TB Drive)
You only need storage space for artwork and other files and you don't need it to be "Bootable".
1. Super Duper - "Backup Script"
First Time Backup Use: "Backup - User Files" (this is for storage and is not a "Bootable" backup. Good for storage of files)
Second or Third Backup Use: "Backup - User Files" (this is for storage and is not a "Bootable" backup. Good for storage of files)

2. Leave "Repair Permissions" unchecked.

3. Super Duper - "During Copy Setting"
First time Backup Use: "Erase Backup, then copy files from Macintosh HD" to backup the Mac HD (this will create a "Bootable" backup)
Second or Third Backup Use: "Smart Update" or "Copy Newer Files from Macintosh Hard Drive to Backup" to backup the Mac HD (this will create a "Bootable" backup but will only copy or delete files and folders as necessary taking less time.)
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dnanian 10-21-2010 08:16 AM

A1: Yes, that's why it says that in the interface.

A2: always use "Backup - all files" with "Smart Update" for both drives (since you're starting out with empty drives anyway, there's no reason to use erase-then-copy the first time). Do not use "Backup - user files". "Backup - user files" backs up your Home folder(s). Your Artwork drive does not have home folders.

Paint Guy 10-25-2010 02:56 PM

Thanks Dave.

Instead of partitioning my 2 TB drives I have decided to return my 2 TB drives for (2) 1 TB drives. I will back up my OS and Applications onto a 300 GB drive and use the 1 TB Drives for storage only. These drives will only hold data files such as: Graphics, Audio, Video. Images etc.

http://support.apple.com/kb/ht2355

When Should Journaling Be Used? - Journaling is best suited for servers requiring high availability, servers containing volumes with many files, and servers containing data that is backed up at infrequent intervals (nightly, for example). If a volume contains read-only data that is not mission-critical, it may not be necessary to turn on journaling if performance is more important than safety. If your server contains high-bandwidth usage data files, such as large video, graphics, or audio files, you may want to weigh the benefits of using journaling against the performance needed to access your data. In most cases, the impact of journaling upon data access performance are unnoticeable to users, but its implementation may not be practical for servers where data access demands outweigh its benefits. - Apple

After reading this article I am not sure which is better. "Journaled" or "Not Journaled". They talk about performance being more important than safety. Does this mean if I don't use "journaled" that my data is at risk of being lost? I want the drive to be used for storage so which is best IYO? "Mac OS Extended (Journaled)" or "Mac OS Extended"

Thanks
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dnanian 10-25-2010 06:30 PM

I always use Journaled.

Paint Guy 10-27-2010 03:09 PM

Ok, thanks Dave. OK, I know I have asked too many questions already so I will stop soon. Just a few more so I get this right and don't screw it up. Thanks.

Q1 - Is reformatting a hard drive hard on it. Does it wear it out a little every time you reformat a drive?

On the G-Drive Website it says: "Your G-Drive external hard drive is formatted at the factory for use with Mac OS. Just plug it in and it will mount on the desktop. The G-DRIVE is formatted at the factory HFS+ with Journaling and is Time Machine ready right out of the box!"

Q2 - I plan to have the drive as "one" partition so do I need to format the drive again using "Disc Utility" or is it best to run disc utility anyways and partition the drive?


Q3 - After mounting the drive on the desktop and pressing (Option + I) here's what it said. Why has it used 240.6 MB? Is this the normal amount used when you format a drive. Seems like a lot to me.

G-Drive 1TB
Capacity: 931.19 GB
Available: 930.96 GB
Used: 240.6 MB
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dnanian 10-27-2010 03:11 PM

A hard drive kind of wears out every time you do anything with it.

Just because a drive is already formatted doesn't mean you should just use it. Some manufacturers (WD comes to mind) ship drives with the same low-level IDs, which can mess things up. I always advise a simple format, which assigns a new ID, before using it.

Q2: See above. (If the drive is not properly partitioned you do have to repartition it. The FAQ explains.)


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