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00afro
07-06-2005, 07:04 AM
hi dave,

this is a newbie question, i have looked at other questions on the forum but they don't seem to be asking quite the same thing...

i made a safety clone of my 10.3.9 on an external LaCie drive. I used the "share applications and users option". I would like to upgrade this safety clone to tiger, while keeping (for now) my old panther install on the internal drive. I'm a musician and unfortunately have some bits of software that either don't work in Tiger or that i can't afford to upgrade just yet.

i envisage that I will be using the Tiger install to test stuff, get used to the new OS and in fact almost like the way you reccommend to use a safety clone. I would like to be able to test some of my apps in tiger, but still have the safety of being able to run them in panther if they don't like tiger.

I was wondering: if i upgrade the safety clone to tiger, what happens to my shared applications and prefs? i notice that in my safety clone, there are aliased folders to my applications and user folders - will a tiger upgrade be able to deal with aliases or will it overwrite those links?

if i decided to upgrade my original panther install instead, do i need to erase the clone i have now and make a new one that doesn't share apps and users (in case i have to revert to panther)?

I'm also curious because i had to reregister a music app when i booted from my safety clone because the hardware in my computer had changed (different boot drive) and the authorization depends on my hardware. if i had done this, would it have knocked out the authorization i already had because preferences are shared?

sorry if these are really basic questions because i'm a bit new at this [which is why i registered SuperDuper! :) ].

dnanian
07-06-2005, 09:13 AM
Not basic questions at all.

Shared preferences are just that -- shared -- as long as they're "user" preferences and not "system" preferences. For example, bluetooth pairings are "system" preferences and aren't shared. Your login items are "user" preferences.

Tiger is a bit different than previous OS releases in that they changed the way some data is stored. Mail is radically different, as are iCal and iSync. Because of this, you need to be more careful when rolling back.

I've detailed this in the "Tiger Compatibility" post in the FAQ, so take a look there.

Once you're done testing on the Safety Clone, you'll just boot back to the 'real' drive and upgrade it to Tiger.

The Music App needed to be re-registered because it's way WAY too restrictive -- a common feature of this kind of protection. (Locking to drives is really dumb, as the drive is the one thing that tends to fail.) But, it's hard to say what'll happen on the original, since I don't know where the activation preference is stored. You'll just have to try it...

Hope that offers a small amount of help, at least!

00afro
07-06-2005, 11:05 AM
whee a swift reply, thanks

I've just read the tiger compatibility faq and that was very useful. I think the iSync issue would affect me, so just to make sure i have it clear:

I need to remake my safety clone with a script that adds the command to copy the syncservice file (so it is not shared) to the default shared users safety clone script.

back up my Ical calenders

then I can install tiger over the safety clone.

is there a "special safety clone script that doesn't share the iSync data" yet? :)

thanks for your reply , it's very helpful

dnanian
07-06-2005, 11:45 AM
Fortunately, iSync changed to store its data in a different location, so you shouldn't have to isolate it -- I'd just suggest resetting all devices when/if you roll back from your data on .Mac (make sure you're nice and synced first).

Make sense?

00afro
07-06-2005, 02:35 PM
after thinking about it a bit :)

i can upgrade to tiger and use it on the safety clone without having to first make iSync a non-shared app. (because the new iSync (tiger) stores data somewhere different from the old)

but when i go back to use iSync from my panther install, i should reset my devices.

i guess this is because the tiger iSync data is not compatible with the panther iSync data (from your compatibility faq)

:) :)

does this mean i now have a dual boot panther/tiger capability?

thanks for your help

dnanian
07-06-2005, 02:59 PM
That's right -- it should also "restore" your calendars from the copy stored on .Mac: that's why you want to reset from the data "up on the server" -- .Mac.

Don't forget Mail! The non-IMAP mail issue is probably the biggest one to be concerned about.

00afro
07-06-2005, 03:58 PM
:)

my main mail is .mac, the POP ones I can set to keep messages for a month on the server, so I should be ok

thanks a lot for your help:):)

dnanian
07-06-2005, 03:59 PM
OK. Be careful... remember that things you file in folders are going to be affected.

dnanian
07-06-2005, 04:00 PM
(Folders for the POP accounts, of course: you can use the IMAP folders on .mac to store messages, and those'll be fine.)

00afro
07-08-2005, 05:59 AM
or should that be RESULT! as we say in London when something works:)

i was able to very easily upgrade my safety clone to tiger and 10.4.1

so far, there have been a few issues with shared "stuff" - I've had to reinstall some things like my Wacom tablet driver/ my midi interface drivers/ my broadband modem drivers but this was all pretty straightforward. in most cases i didn't even have to d/l newer drivers, just re-install the old ones.

the new installs replace the aliased ones from the safety clone (which isn't anymore:)).

I will have issues with Audio Units which don't show up in the tiger install because they live in /Library/Audio (not the user Library) which don't seem to have made it into the clone or into tiger (or is this just that they don't show up because they are not compatible with tiger?).

I'm now considering re-installing previously shared apps one by one in the tiger install to make sure everything works ok

anyway ...this has allowed me to slowly test and migrate stuff from panther to tiger so THANKS for your help and definitely Thanks for SuperDuper!!

dnanian
07-08-2005, 10:50 AM
Some -- usually very few -- applications don't like running if they're aliased: your three entries sound like three of them.

What I'd suggest is to create a new Safety Clone script, include the old one, and then just tell SuperDuper! to copy the three folders that aren't working when aliased. There's a description of this in the User's Guide.

Audio Units should *certainly* have been copied: we copy everything in /Library except for some Sync Services stuff, which is shared...

00afro
07-09-2005, 12:44 PM
only a couple of the third party audio units i had in my ~/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/Components survived the install of tiger. It may be that the upgrade deleted all the non compatible ones? (I hadn't checked the safety clone when I made it to see if they had been cloned then)

the same goes for all the other plugin types (MAS, VST). I can see them when I look at the corresponding folder on my panther install.

strange - in any case your tip about making a new clone with stuff that doesn't work well aliased will be very helpful:)


*** EDIT*** ok, just guess who did an archive and install tiger upgrade... so the missing plugins are all in a neat little previous systems folder. These are not aliased to the ones on the panther install, which makes it easier for me to test them
:o :)

though if i'd done a straight upgrade to tiger they wouldn't have been moved out of the Library in the first place

dnanian
07-09-2005, 12:53 PM
Well, a Safety Clone doesn't do anything to the files in your Home folder. So, they must have been removed by Tiger, but I've certainly never heard of the install removing files like this, especially those "Owned" by the user.

But, it DOES make sense that an archive-and-install would move them from /Library/... (not ~/Library). Straight upgrade would have definitely been my suggestion...